0:10 Today on Must Play, we're back in the valley, but this time at a resort course. We're talking about Camelback Ambiente, which is part of the JW Marriott in Scottsdale, AZ. I'm Sean Massey with me as always as TJ Van Gutten. Our guest this week is a total vibe out on the course. Flowing hair, strong mustache, silky swing. 0:28 Please welcome to the pod for the first time Austin Rezonico, who you may know better as Senor Rez on Instagram. Rez, thanks for joining us. Brother of. Course, thank you for having me. Is everything I said is true from what I can tell TJ you got to play with him recently. Is the swing look as good in person? 0:44 The I, I've never seen anyone so beautifully play a you might call it a cut, but it's definitely a slice off the tee. But he knows, he knows exactly where it's gonna go. It's not like, hey, sometimes it's a 10 yard slice and hey, sometimes it's a 40 yard slice. 1:00 Like it is a very predictable shot shape that the man knows how to work 'cause he's a great golfer. There you go. Yeah. But do you agree with that statement, Rez? 100% not a slice. That is a cut, high fade, whatever you want to call it. 1:19 But a slice is a ball that goes out of bounds. There you go, fair. Fair. Control my slice as TJ puts it. What's your What's your move when the hole goes the other way though? Do you have a straight? Ball, you know, I I can play. I feel like I've gotten to the point to where I can hit the straight ball. 1:37 I can even play a draw. Sometimes they get overcooked, you know? Yeah, yeah. What was it was Elite Trevino that said you can talk to a fade, you can not talk to a draw. So yeah, but when I get a hold of a draw, I feel like I hit it a good 30 to 50 yards further than. 1:58 And we're talking with the big stick, right? Yeah, I can. I can hit a monster draw with the driver. That's not to say it might go a little bit too far left, but yeah, I I feel like I can, I can play them when I need to. 2:14 Yeah, I'm looking forward to seeing it. Yeah, Congrats. By the way, on your call it recent modelling with Devro. Thank you. I'll confidently say you're pulling it off, you're making it look easy, but how was the actual shoot? Oh man, super fun. Those guys are great. 2:31 They make it easy, you know, high vibes. Every photo shoot that we do, they're very what's the word they they definitely help encourage me and let me know that you know, I'm doing great. You're a natural, this and that, and I'm just. 2:48 Standing up there. Like a dingus. And apparently it comes out looking good. So yeah, no, it's been a lot of fun. We just did a shoot last week and it was like the first shoot that we had done that was like real professional, like it was in a studio gallery, if you will, prior to that. 3:09 Some of the other shoots that I've done with them, it's all been out on the course, you know, to where I'm in my element. But yeah, this one last week was, I felt a little bit out of my element, but they made it work. We made it work. It was a lot of fun. That's cool. 3:24 Yeah, TJ just did some too. And for Chubby's? I saw the commercial. I saw that red hair running down the hill immediately. Yeah, it to be honest, it never feels natural. I mean, at least for me as another fellow non professional model, it just when people tell you to do things and they're like, give us a little bit more of a smile and then and then you do it and they're like, no, that's too much smile. 3:48 And you're like trying to find a weird bounce where it's like you can tell when a person is a model and like they take those directions and it's like boop, boop. And they just go right to what they are and they're like, and you can hear the photographer being like, yes, perfect, like exactly that. Don't move it. Whereas guys like us who just people like us, 'cause we have unique looks like myself and Rez, we're just kind of out there winging it. 4:13 Absolutely. I mean, I have 0 modelling profession, so yeah, I definitely feel like a fish out of water when I do it. But like I said, they're very encouraging. They, they give me great direction. So yeah, they, they make it easy. 4:30 It's it's a lot of fun too. Well, Speaking of looks, you kind of have a vintage 90s eighties thing going on, like is that accurate? And how'd you? Get it? When I first started playing golf, which was three years ago this summer hit the three-year mark, I felt like I was my my look was I was trying to look like a tour player, you know, tight Lululemon pants or Viori pants, tight polyester shirt. 4:59 And then just, you know, learning more about the game, you learn more about like the, you know, old school guys. And I just really dig that look from the 80s and 90s. So, yeah, more, more fabric, little little 100% cotton. 5:19 I try to always veer towards that. So yeah, I definitely try to make that vintage golfer look come to come to play. It it just reminds me of my dad. He's got all of the same clothes and his favorite golfer was Freddie Couples, so he always had the 80s baggy look going on. 5:39 And I have some of those same clothes, like some hand me downs that I've worn in the past. The cotton is a tough move in the heat sometimes. Really. You think so? I think, I think it's good, better for your skin, but sometimes it doesn't breathe. It feels like you're sweating inside a little bit more. 5:55 OK, so this is my take. This like moisture wicking polyester that most all these brands are using. Yeah they do breathe well, but or I I shouldn't even say breathe well, they dry well. So I find myself producing more sweat in those. 6:15 Yes, I'm sweating in the cotton. But then once I sweat, then like your body kind of cools down like that 100% cotton kind of uses that to cool yourself down. So yeah, I just find myself sweating less in 100% cotton than I do the Poly blend. 6:33 And that's a perfect segue in today's sponsor Chubbies talking to us about their new performance polos. No, I'm just kidding. I was like, are we really doing jumps? No, but that would have been, that would have been incredible if Rez was just on here talking about how much he does not really like performance fabric. 6:51 And then I was like, all right, surprise, I actually Chubby sponsored the entire episode. We're sending polos to everybody. All listeners are entered into a giveaway. No, I, I tried turning people to the 100% cotton and I hit em with that, that kind of, I mean, and, and Google it, right? 7:08 Google most breathable fabric out there. You're gonna get cotton, you're gonna get silk and then, and then you'll get like polyester down the line. And you know, they all breathe well. I just find that cotton for me keeps my body the most regulated. 7:25 It without going too far down an apparel diatribe, this is must play. We will talk about the golf courses, I promise folks. But. Can anyone remember what the golf course was for this podcast? We can just just look at, yeah, just look at the hat. It's camelback. The biggest thing for guys, honestly, is that most guys just don't take care of their clothes. 7:45 And something that is 100% cotton needs to be like cared for in terms of washing it properly, drying it properly, hanging it properly, like, and most guys are just like whatever wash cycle, whatever dry cycle. 8:01 So polyester fabrics and like retain their colors pretty well and like won't bleed and mutt and won't shrink. So just like whatever does that and works the best is what people tend to lean to because then they're like, oh, why would I ever? 8:19 I've had friends before who've had issues with clothes and I say, well, what do you do about like, do you hang dry anything? They're like, hang dry. What are you, what are you talking about? Like Sean knows exactly who I'm talking about if he's listening. Hey, we're calling you out. I mean, I had this conversation with him. So it's not a surprise. 8:34 But it's just, it's just for most guys, it's out of ease of use really. Right. And that that's, that's facts, because when I wash my vintage polos, I'm not throwing them in the dryer on high heat. I'll maybe throw them in there for a minute or two just to kind of get them warm and put that. 8:52 I'm laying them on my bed, I'm pressing them, I'm drying them, air drying. Yeah. You got to preserve the the goods, you know. Damn committed. I like it. Yeah. Let's transition to the course. I'm going to flip over to you, TJ 'cause I was with you for your first time out here. 9:08 What was your first impression? Well, let's see, first impression, phenomenal practice facility jumps out right away. I won't go too far deep in that cause we'll probably talk about it in the pros. Maybe one of the most eventful things I've ever seen happen on a golf course happened the day that Sean and I played it earlier this year. 9:30 It was, was it Easter weekend? I believe it was Easter weekend. Maybe. Because I we were like, Oh yeah, there's families together and there was like a semi younger couple with their kids and then very clearly their grandparents pulled out to the driving range with them. 9:47 And somehow, someway, the older gentleman who was driving the golf cart with with his wife got his foot stuck on the gas pedal on the golf cart and they drove it up like hopped the curb at the range, drove it around 180 and hit like a trash can and then flipped the thing over onto its side and right next to us as we're like, we were literally he hit our cart, he hit our cart. 10:14 Then we were coming off the range to go start our route and it threw me for a wild, wild loop. Like it took a good three holes for us to settle in, but. He was OK. How old was this gentleman? 10:31 So he was, he was older. He had to have been in his like, late 70s, early 80s. Yeah, he, he, him and his wife were both older, just laid on the ground the whole time. He his leg was bleeding. She was on her back flat on her back. 10:48 And TJ ran to go get someone from the pro shop. And this is just a coincidence. I'm not complaining. My brand new Jones bag that I just got was on the back of T JS cart but it wasn't strapped in properly and he took off and it fell and it ripped and so the video we posted of me like getting a new Jones bag was because of this incident. 11:10 OK, nice. Yeah, and like, I didn't even care this guy, I just wanted to make sure he was OK. And so like, you know, I'm, I'm kind of making sure he's not bleeding too hard. And then like the woman's like, OK, but TJ comes back with people and finally, like we're settling in or whatnot. 11:27 And then he's like, Oh yeah, by the way, your bag ripped. I'm like, no, I learned in the bag A. New bag. 1st. Round I was about to call out Jones and be like, hey Jones, come on man. No, they hooked it up. They hooked it up. They no questions asked, took care of Sean like Jones Berry stand up bag company and we're like, no, we're just going to ship you a brand new bag. 11:46 Don't even worry about sending us back the old. One, but thankfully the couple was fine. We heard from that. And do you remember what the starter said, DJ? No. What'd he say? Starter's like looking at his watch like we're late and we're like we explained to him what just happened and he's this old guy as well, and he's kind of like, yeah, you got to stay on your toes out there that. 12:08 Might have been my uncle. My my uncle is a starter out of camel bags. So. Oh really? Yeah, very well could have been him. Could have been, could have been. I will say, I will say when it comes to the course, unique layout, very thought provoking on a lot of the holes, not just your straightforward, you know, bomb and gouge type course. 12:32 Like there's a lot, there's a lot in play to think about while you're out there. Not your traditional 9 hole loops. It is a out and back designed course where there is no loop at the turn to come back by the pro shop. I will say this day we had played golf earlier that morning and the prior day, Correct, Sean? 12:55 You had played earlier the prior day with at Biltmore. You're right. You're right. I you're right. I Well, no, no, no. Yeah. I had played Biltmore and then we played Mountain Shadows that morning. This course has a wash that runs down the right side of the course the entire time. And if you hit a slice like I hit rez doesn't hit a slice. 13:14 I hit a slice. You find yourself in a lot of trouble when you play this golf course a lot. I shot a 56 on the front at this golf course, and if I could have left at the turn, I probably would have left at the turn. That's how bad of a day I was having. 13:31 And I kept my head down and was like, well, I'm not gonna drive from the furthest point in the golf course all the way back. Like I'm just gonna play the holes to get back and just do what I do and just continue to hit driver knowing eventually it's probably going to go in the direction that I want it to go. 13:49 And then I shot a personal best 9 on the back. I shot a 40 on the back, which was like insane to go 5640. Like obviously hands down the hands down the biggest 9 hole swing I've ever seen on a card. And all because you kept driver in play. 14:07 So it's a it's a it feels like it's a gettable course if you can just keep keep your drive safe. But I guess that's golf like if I'm just describing golf, but it also like it feels like it's open too. Like it's not it it's it's very like reminiscent of a lot of like somewhat of desert golf, but it feels a lot more open than that. 14:28 Where like you don't run into as many of the the gravel dirt ish areas. There's more like rough or some kind of brush and not just actual like rocks or like designated desert areas I guess I would say. 14:44 Yeah, Rez, what about you? First impressions, Yeah, definitely that last statement of it being somewhat desert layout, but without the desert elements. Like you said, you're not going to find yourself in a gravelly area with rocks around then you're going to Jack up your clubs. 15:04 You're either in like someone's side yard. That's like real thick grass, right? It's like people's back gates go out to the golf course, like their backyard, the golf course. So you're, yeah, you're either in super tall brush, grass, rough, whatever you want to call it, or you're in the wash. 15:22 And yeah, that wash, like TJ was saying, is prevalent the whole round. It just runs down the right side, splitting the course usually the entire time. And I've had my rounds out there where the, the the fade was fading a little bit too much. 15:44 But yeah, it's, it's if, if you're able to, just like TJ was saying, if you can control your first shot off the tee, right, you, you can set yourself up for success. But I mean, that's golf in general. But yeah, it seems to me like everything almost kind of feeds towards that wash as well. 16:05 So yeah, it's it's a fun course, but it's definitely challenging as well. Yeah, I mean, that's The thing is that I, I would say that I did not on that back 9. I, I did not hit every fairway with my driver. But like, if you can keep it in play, it still offers up the opportunity that you're still gonna have some good looks into the greens from there. 16:28 Yes. Yeah, as a lefty who plays a slight fade, this is a dream course 'cause the trouble's on the right and on the left it opens up for most part. So it's a completely different ball game for me where I'm not worried about the wash really ever. I'm only ever worried about like how far left is too far into like some of those between the path and the homes, like, you know, But like I can usually punch out and find the ball versus you lose the ball in the wash. 16:56 There's no finding it in that wash. Yeah, what's your connection with the cork? You said your uncle's a starter. My uncle is a starter there. He he's retired. So he just kind of did this to get out of the house. In fact, my golf, yeah, free golf. 17:16 I don't even think he works during the summer. He's like, Nah, I'll be back during the peak season. Pretty sure he works for free. I don't, I don't know how much he gets paid, but he comes home with buckets of balls. He's always given me brand new Pro V ones that he found in that wash. 17:34 But yeah, he, he, him having that connection working there, definitely I can get out there. I don't know if I should be saying this or not, but for $20.00 I just I just give the cart guys 20 bucks and then and then the rounds all mine. 17:51 It is, it is. It is no secret that if you know the right people at any golf course, the golf can either be relatively cheap all the way up to three. That is, that is not that is not an industry secret that we are leaking here on the podcast. 18:06 We're not. We're not exposing the biz. We'll call it free with a $20 tip to the cart guys at the end of the There you go. Precisely. Yeah. Yeah, my first impression, I played this a long time ago. I did not play it before became Camelback on Beyoncé, which I'll cover in my history. 18:26 But when I did first play, there's only so many courses in that little pocket of central Scottsdale that you can play publicly that are like Kalenbeck on Beyoncé. If you have Phoenician or you have some of the other courses that are on the mountain or around the mountain, you get a lot of that desert that comes in play. 18:45 But in on Beyoncé and Padre, both courses there, it is very much more linked style with a lot of grass, right? And if you think of other course in that area that are linked style with grass, they're not as nice as Camelback and Beyoncé. There are a lot of the courses that I don't prefer to go play if someone's playing. 19:02 So that's where like I feel like this holds a special play somewhat because it's one of the only courses that has that and it's still elevated enough to provide a great golf experience. It's still very tough. It's a great course. We'll get into the pros and cons, but I do think it's a bit pricey for what it is, but we'll get into that. 19:22 So all I have to say is I I was impressed the first time I came out here. It definitely felt different than the majority of the North Scottsdale courses that I grew up playing for sure. Most definitely, yeah, I would agree with all that. Should I jump into the history? 19:38 Dude, I, that's one, that's one of the things that intrigues me about camelback 'cause I'm, I'm a hound when it comes to vintage golf, right? And I always seem to be coming across vintage Camelback Golf Club stuff. Yeah. 19:53 So yeah, I just love the history. So yeah, let us have it. Another vote for the history on this pod. There we go. All right, before we get into history, we're going to hear more from our sponsor for today's episode, Clinch Golf. This episode of Must Play is brought to you by Clinch Golf, a brand that we love and stand behind. 20:10 Clinch Golf is reimagining the Golf Club with cutting edge performance materials that outlast and outperform leather gloves. Traditional gloves wear out fast, they lose their grip and they can't handle the elements. Clinch's tactile gloves deliver all season traction, they maintain their grip even when wet, and they're going to last twice as long. 20:26 Plus, they're breathable, washable, and they're touch screen friendly, so you can still check in on those parlays while you're out on the course. It's time to upgrade your golf game with the next generation of golf gloves. See the difference for yourself at clinchgolf.com and use promo code FAIR WAGERS for 10% off. All right, let's dive into the history of Camelback Ambiente. 20:43 So look on a map for Camelback Ambiente and you'll see the course slices diagonally through Scottsdale along a Washington just north of Camelback and Mummy Mountain, the wash we talked about all through the intro of this pod. In the early days, before Scottsdale was even an official city, this area was called the Slew by locals and was a low lying, flood prone tangle of desert brush and weeds. 21:06 When it wasn't flooded by seasonal rains, it was actually a popular spot for hunting rabbits and quail. And the area of the wash east of the present day course that is now El Dorado Park was nicknamed the Mesquite's back in the day for its wild growing plants, weeds and trees. And legend has it that it was an out of the way place for boys to quote and quote settle their differences. 21:27 So as Scottsdale grew in size and population after World War Two, annual flooding of the Indian Bend, Wash became a nuisance for residents. Every monsoon or winter storm would bring rushing water through the area and would actually cut off access for people trying to go north or South across what was now a river for days. 21:45 And I'm gonna put a photo up in the edit here showing a brave old car trying to forge their way across this flood. Where the present day camelback course stands, you can kind of see in the distance the mountains. And I mean, TJ, you and I, growing up here, we saw this even after the Indian Bend Wash was created, it would flood like this like. 22:03 All the time, even at well, and then the Indian, I mean, what is now Silverado used to be part of the same wash. And I, my, the first three jobs I ever had were at the pavilions on Indian Bend. And I remember every time it would rain, you'd see on the news somebody trying to cross the Indian Bend wash before they put, before they put Silverado in there. 22:25 And you could still cross it, sorry. And it's not Indian Ben. It's like the next one down. I can't remember what it is between Indian Ben and McDonald, but you'd get people trying to forge that the back way to where their house is instead of going down to McDonald. And it's it was the same thing, just cars get stuck every time because Arizonans don't know what to do when it rains. 22:43 Yep, that was when it did rain in Arizona. It doesn't rain in. Arizona anymore? Let's shed a single tear. Rain that actually the good old days of Arizona getting rained. Oh man. OK, so beginning in 1959, the US Army Corps of Engineers was called in because of this problem, and they held public meetings to come up with a solution, and their answer was to build a miles long NS concrete channel to contain these floodwaters. 23:11 Although a concrete channel would actually probably work, it would also create a permanent visual blemish to an area that Scottsdale and his visitors found aesthetically pleasing. So Scottsdale resident and professional landscape architect Bill Walton suggested an innovative Scottsdale style solution to counter the US Army Corps of Engineers concrete channel concept. 23:31 He proposed the city create a grass line system of parks and recreational facilities that would channel the floodwaters when necessary, but encourage land owners to build above the low lying Wash area. And Scottsdale loved the idea so much, they appointed Walton to chair an Indian Ben Wash task force, and together they launched the Indian Ben Wash Greenbelt Flood Control Project. 23:53 So in 1964, voters approved $1.5 million to develop the wash area and add parks, graded crossings, new home developments, and most importantly, new Golf courses. Trivia time for the boys here. You guys can work together on this one. OK. Can you name the five courses that opened as a result of the Indian Ben Wash project before 1980? 24:17 Five points. So hold on, do both do do the camelback courses count as one or two as one? OK, so there's that. Does Stone Creek in PV count as one? 24:34 Stone Creek opened in 1979, so yes, that does K. Silverado doesn't. Silverado came. Silverado came way later. Silverado was in 2000, so it did not come before 1980, right? Rez, help me brother. 24:51 Dude, I'm racking my brain right now. I'm trying to think of courses that kind of run that area. You know, Mountain Shadows, I know is pretty old. Or it used to be called something else. Is that a part of it? Yeah. Not part of didn't open because of the wash. 25:06 That's not part of it, no. If you think on a map, the Wash goes pretty far down. Continental, Continental Coronado. Coronado. There we go. And is it God, what's the one that used to be all the way South into Tempe that is now the that's now Schnepp Farms? 25:25 What did it used to be? Is that the one that I'm talking about? It was in Green Creek, so you're way off with Schnepp. Not Schnepp Farms, it's no. But there's the there's the farm spot behind Big Surf. So are you, what is that called for legacy or like what's the other one? Ravens there. 25:42 TJ No, you're way too. You're way too far South. We're in. TJ The one you're thinking of is not it. No, you're thinking of, you're thinking of Cyprus and it's not Cyprus. No, I'm not thinking of Cyprus, but I. I'll give you a hint. The last one's close to Silverado. Why? Am I drawing a massive blank on? 26:03 It it has two courses called Palm and Pine. Oh, McCormick. McCormick Ranch. I could see the sign like off of Scottsdale, but I couldn't think of the course. Yeah, OK. So you play any of those courses and you look at the pro shops and you know they all have that like 70s feel to them, right? 26:23 They all opened in that era. So you got McCormick in 72, Camelback in 72, Continental in 77, Stone Creek in 79, and Coronado is actually in 65. It was the first one built as a result of this wash so. That's. Right. Yeah. 26:40 So the, the, yes, the approximately 250 acre Camelback Inn Golf Club was made as a result of this in 1972 and the original Padre course was constructed first. Then in 1978, expansion plans for a second golf course called the Indian Bend Course were approved by the town of Paradise Valley. 27:01 The Indian Ben Course was the 2nd 18, a Jack Snyder design that was a solid, if not particularly memorable layout that followed the Indian Ben Wash in a basic out and back routing. In later years, the turf would actually become quite tired and generally suffered from a lack of attention, and Camelback was once the top upscale daily feed course for tours and locals. 27:20 But the 90s brought a slew of competition from the Troons, Greyhawks and other courses that would start opening up in North Scottsdale and provided more wow factor. So Camelback's luster and popularity actually faded in the 90s. In 1998, the Padre course, then over 25 years old, was completely renovated as part of a $17 million project to redesign the course and construct a new 36,000 square foot clubhouse. 27:45 This was funded by the JW Marriott, which had taken over the property and added it as one of their resorts amenities. Then in 2013, the property's 3 decade old Indian Bend course underwent a major $10 million renovation by a guy named Jason Straka of Frying Venom Environmental Golf Design, and he wanted to improve both playability and flooding being a key element of this course. 28:09 They knew in order to get this course to be in good shape and become more manageable, it had to figure out what to do about flooding that was coming still throughout the course despite the whole Indian Men Wash project. So it was extremely flat and it meant it was harder to drain after big rains. 28:26 Flat courses were also less fun, so there was plenty of work to do. They moved about 365,000 cubic yards of material and they removed a lot from the water much of the course butts up against and used that to raise parts of the layout, improving not only the fun factor but the ability for it to now to start to drain. 28:44 They also removed trees and added more native desert areas. And when it reopened it was named Ambiente. Do one of you guys want to guess why it was called Ambiente or translate that from Spanish for us? Especially you sted your res where's? My phone at I don't know what is it, why and what does ambiente mean in Spanish? 29:11 Environment. Environment. So it was named that because they tried to basically live up to that name and involve native species and all kinds of stuff to make this more environmentally friendly. So living up to that name. Straka's new course design embodied many of those changes, including a reduction in turf grass, which saves millions of gallons of water annually in installation of native snoring desert vegetation, the adoption of Operation Pollinator, which was an initiative that works with courses to create habitats for pollinators and to enhance the visual appeal. 29:45 Straka actually worked with the team at Marriott to formulate a number of designs that aim to add challenges to the course play and enhance the visual interest. One of these is right on the 1st hole. If you ever go decide between Ambiente and Padre and you choose Padre and you kind of tee off, but from the clubhouse or where you're about to go, you look down to your left and you see Ambiente. 30:06 There's no doubt Ambiente looks a little sexier. It's got that big bunker, the Bluffs, and it's just like, oh, maybe we should have played that course. That hole was part of the design to draw you in essentially and to give you that feel of link style golf more than Padre does. 30:21 Right, 'cause it's, it's hole one for Ambiente and it's hole 10 that's right next to or Padre. Hole 10 is right next to hole one and Beyoncé like you literally like kind of have to take it out of it when you're driving the hole 10 on Padre cause Beyoncé was right there. 30:41 NBA one is tough, man. It's like you, you, you can't really hit driver there 'cause it's like you hit it out straight too far. You're in the. Are we allowed to curse on this show? Oh. Yes, absolutely. You hit it too far straight, you're in the shit. 30:58 And then if you come up because it's a hard left right, it's like the hole goes straight and then just hard left and then the Green's right here. So. I like it. Yeah, you can play. John loves it that. Will draw a fade of yours, but yeah. 31:16 And Beyoncé is definitely different. Way more different than Padre. Completely different. We'll get into the pros and cons actually in just a moment. I have one more thing here to add, which if you've played on Beyoncé, maybe you know, it's a subtle thing that I've never noticed until I did the history here. 31:34 But they redesigned the holes so that each one has five distinct T boxes, and the designs allow each T to be positioned at an angle that helps to push errant golf balls towards the interior of the course and away from the yards of the homes. 31:50 If you've been on this course, you'll see the homes are massive. There's some really nice homes on some of these courses, right. The T boxes are all tilted in a little bit. They don't want you trying to send one's parallel to the homes. So they kind of try and funnel you into the interior a little bit. Yeah. 32:08 And then the golf cart pass were reconfigured to place the rider away from the new and deeper main wash channel that we talked about that goes along the right. So you'll notice the cart path never really follows along the wash. It's always opposite the wash along the course. It's. Just a It's just a terrible day. 32:24 If you slice the ball and it's cart math only, it is a long. Got a lot of steps in that day. Really, really getting your 10,000 in for sure and then some. Yes. So All in all, this course, it's a triumph of civil engineering. It's fun to play, no doubt, but we'll put it up to the must play test to determine if it's a must when visiting the Scottsdale area. 32:45 So why don't we kick off with you Rez? What are some of the pros? The goods you have for the Ambiente course covering anything? Well, I think the challenge, I love challenging golf, right? I like the challenge myself. I like playing hard courses. And to me, there's really no tee shots that you can just hit it straight out. 33:07 You've kind of got to play. You got to have a target, right, because you hit it straight out. You hit it straight out into the wash. You got to keep it more left. Most of the time it's just left. Yeah. Very rarely do you got to hit it right, but yeah, I think that is one of the pros is that it's so challenging. 33:26 It's not an easy layout, it's not crazy, but it is, you know, you got to bring your A game to play well at Ambiente. For sure, and you want to come back and try and beat the score, right? And the Greens, like, like you said, Camelback itself takes really good care of their courses. 33:45 So I have never played either Padre or and Beyoncé. And they're like, man, the Greens are shit. You know, like they're always in great condition. I have that in my pros. It's one of the best conditioned courses throughout the summer and even all the times of the year. 34:00 Yeah. So are we hitting pros right now or are we hitting just pros? All of them just pros, no. Yeah, just pros, no cons yet all. Right. I think the scenery you know you have, it's not as scenic as like say the Phoenician, like you're on Camelback Mountain on Phoenician. 34:22 But I mean you have beautiful views, pretty much the whole round. You can see Camelback in the distance, the homes that you're playing around one of the homes backyard has a a race track like a go Kart race track in the back. I don't know if you've. Ever noticed that I pointed it out to TJ? 34:38 But. We drove over to it to make sure that we saw it. Yeah, they, there's, there's some money in that area for sure. So yeah, I'd, I'd say, you know, course conditions, scenic views, challenging golf. 34:56 Those are some of my pros right now. Yeah, I like it, TJ. Yeah, I agree with pretty much everything Rez said. Like the you get some pretty cool backdrops with the mountains. There's some pretty cool like I I know I took some videos while we were out there where you get some pretty nice natural shot tracers where you can see the ball flight across camelback or mummy mountain the whole time, which is pretty cool. 35:20 Like I touched on in first impressions, practice area checks, like all the boxes, right grass range, free balls. That's always a huge plus, always a huge plus. Love when I go to check in and I'm like all right, tee time, cart fee and a small bucket. 35:37 And they're like, don't worry about the bucket. And I'm like, I already like you. It's a good. Start to my. Day and yeah, chipping Green's good. They've got like the big the big, like push rake to try and group all the balls together for you. There's a bunker out there and then like the putting green and then they have the separate nice bigger putting green by the first tee. 35:57 So like even if you're a little pressed for time, you can still toss down a few while you're over there waiting at the starter and roll a few and you know, get some faux confidence into your brain before the round. I also I can't believe Rez didn't touch on it but like the the logo is an all timer. 36:18 Can you hold that up close so people can? Yeah, can. You give me a can you give me a, a real close one here for the people at home, Yeah. I'll give you I'll give you a breakdown on this hat. So we have the iconic camelback logo, the camel with the draped blanket over there with the C right, the pool, not quite old English, but that font spelling camelback. 36:41 You have the classic rope for you know, there's this iconic for golf hats. This is this is an imperial imperial, one of the game changers and golf hats back in the day. OG Imperial logo too. 36:58 Yeah, so I found this thrifting as I do, I think I was out in the Scottsdale area. There's this thrift shop that is, I can't remember the name of it, but it's all dedicated to like animal shelters. So everything that you buy, they they, you know, donate to these animal shelters. 37:16 And it being Scottsdale area, there happened to be some grandpa that dropped off this old hat there so. It's good to have. In pristine In pristine condition, right #1. I had to do my OCD cleaning on this. 37:33 I, I was gonna say put this thing through the ringer, getting it cleaned and making it look crispy, but yeah, it came back to life for sure. No, but major shout out to the team over there for sticking to the logo from the 70s and not doing the, the, the, the, the, the generalization in like sometime in the 2000s being like, oh, our logos not modern enough. 37:59 And then it becomes the rough outline of a camel and an updated sans serif font. The Web 2.0 ification of logos. Exactly like they just said F it and they've stuck with it. And then what happens with that is that as all design styles do, they come back around and it's cyclical and you know it now for sure. 38:21 It's definitely cool again, right? It's it's in it like we talk about it all the time where we love animated animal golf course logos. We love Wild Like Wildwood being one of our favorite courses and and and Huber the the the the Yeti. 38:37 This is another one that has essentially stood the test of time and did not need to be reinvented. Does he have a name? Does the camelback? Does the camel have a name? Not that I found on my research but I mean maybe they call it something you should ask your uncle. 38:56 Ask your uncle or if anyone out here knows, drop it in the comments or shoot us Adm on Instagram. Like let us know if also if there's any history that we ever get like incorrect, not trying to call shout out and Sean does a great job doing the history. But if there's any other Nuggets that we did not uncover, or if you think that, hey, I actually know the real story behind that, that's no, we're yeah, we're willing to do A, to do an addendum here. 39:19 Surprisingly, everyone knows somebody at Augusta when we dropped the Masters stuff. Oh my. God, it was like. I know a guy. My neighbor said that they put ice on the azaleas. Yeah. There's get out of here, pal. I know. OK, either way, practice screen logo. 39:38 Like I said, the course is a little thought provoking because it's not it's it's weird because I I have written down thought provoking course, but kind of open because it doesn't like I said, you you you can go and like your ball might be in the wash and you might be able to find it, But like you're not going to be left with an easy shot in, but your balls like findable. 39:58 So you're not dropping and lying three, you're hitting two. But then you've got to think like. I'm like down in this wash. Do I just try and punch back up into the fairway? Do I try and run one, add a green here? Like it's it gives you a lot of options in terms of playability. And there's there's definitely after like luckily I had Sean there with me who's played it before and Sean's like, all right, here's like, you know, there's always the we talk about the lines and the the lines that Sean sees versus the lines that I see on a golf course. 40:26 And he's like, all right, ideally, like this is where I want to play this ball. But like, knowing you and your game, that side of the fairway is dead, This side of the fairway is good. And that's all I need to pretty much know off the teeth, right? Well, the thought provoking thing comes from I think two things. 40:42 Bunker positioning. They have bunker right where your balls about to land on a lot of those holes. It like they just did a really good job of making you take driver out of your hand. I forget what hole it is on the back 9. I want to say it's 10 or 11. It's 10. I knew you were gonna stay 10. 40:58 Yeah, where the bunker's just right there. And it's like, man, every time I've tried to carry that from the back, T's like I've just gone in that bunker or maybe I caught hold of one. But if I hit my 5 wood, I know I'll have an easy shot in. And then everyone stands up at the T with the driver and you have a 5 wood and you're like, what am I doing? 41:13 Like, I guess I'll go for it. And then you fall for it again. Like that happens all the time on that hole. And then the other thing too is if you think about it, every hole, I'm pretty sure every hole, I can't think of 1 hole that doesn't do this, has a raised green. So every hole leads up to the green and then the green sits on top. 41:31 It's not table top. It's not like where the ball always rolls off. No, it's not a turtle. Not a turtle back. Right. But it's at least raised and on some holes it's raised even more than others, just enough to where you're going to try and run a ball up, you're probably not going to get on, You're probably going to stop right before or you're going to think you're got to hit it a little harder and you're going to go over. 41:52 It's it's always in that in between zone, I feel like on your approach shots. The the par, the par threes are crazy like that. Yeah. Like all of the par threes felt like they were actually elevated on like somewhat turtlebacks or like if it wasn't, it was like, oh, it's this insane two tiered green to where it's like, oh, if you put it down on like the other tier, like it's almost for sure a three. 42:16 Putt I can't remember which hole it is. Is it like is it 8 or 9? That's a par 3 and it's almost like where the wash kind of like ends and then you turn and go back the other way. That's that's 12, 11 or. Twelve, yeah, that Part 3 gets me all the time. 42:34 And that's definitely one of those greens where it's massive green and part of it is lower. And then normally where they put the flag is up higher on that second tier. Yeah, it's tough, that is. Tough, it's 11. It's 11. Yeah, OK. It's low. Yeah, that was that was that was the one that I was thinking about. 42:51 And I think the other one's like 15 or 16 where like the 11 I think has like 3 tiers and is super elevated and then 15's got that one that runs super off to the right and. The water's behind it. And the water's behind it. 43:06 You can't play dead. You can't play short like. Yeah. If the pin's ever on top, you're boned. You're like, there's nothing I can do. I thought I hit a perfect shot and I still rolled all the way down. Other goods I have real quick that we didn't touch on central to Scottsdale. 43:22 Like if you're going to be playing in Scottsdale and you're coming on a trip we've talked about, where are you probably going to stay? You're probably going to stay in Old Town ish or far north if that's what your goal is. But if you stay in Old Town 'cause you want to play more than just Scottsdale courses, you want to go out to Tempe or Phoenix. 43:38 This course is not far from Old Town. Like it's really easy to get to. You don't have to worry about going all the way up to like Boulders and making a day of the trip up to Troon or Boulders. Like you can play this course and go hit up restaurants or bars right after. Like it's it's not hard to get to, which is nice. And then always in great shape. 43:57 I forget, I think Rez, you said it, but like this course, undoubtedly I never have to worry about conditioning on the course. I know it's going to be in good shape. Any other pros before we switch over to cons? I mean, very briefly, like the, the pro shop does a good job of using the logo and the word mark really well. 44:15 They don't just hammer. They do a good job of having like, I won't say definitely an alternate, but but not just saying like, OK, we're just going to put the, the camel and the traditional word mark on all of our merch and be done with it. They let it be interpreted a little bit, which generally tends to allow for for some better merch for sure. 44:35 Yeah, I'll touch on the practice facility. Like TJ was saying, they don't have mats. You're going to be hitting off, correct. But then I also think the chipping area is big enough to where you can actually like let your hands go. You know, a lot of these places like your chipping area is tiny, right? 44:53 You're not really getting any sort of like full swings of of trying to, you know, get the hands warmed up a little bit. So yeah, I think that's huge, big, big part of their training facility, their short game area. That's a good call out. Yeah, that is a good note. 45:09 I hate chipping greens where you're like, I could send this in to everybody. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah all all you can hit is like tiny little nippers and like bump and runs far away. Like every every spot to chip from is within like 4 yards of the green itself. 45:25 Yeah, no, they've got a big open area where you can really let it loose and not worry about killing somebody. Yeah, yeah, All right. Cons I'll kick us off, but I want you to go after me. Rez here. I'm going to start with the first one, which is the obvious one. 45:41 It's pricey. During peak season, this course is easily over $300 and it's not one of the courses I would tell people is worth that rate if they're coming out. And I'm like, yeah, you've never played AZ golf or you want to like get that desert experience. 45:57 You're coming from the Midwest. I'm sending them to probably one of the North Scottsdale courses for that rate versus camelback. That's just the one thing that's like even right now in the summer, it is tomorrow's 117°. God help us all here in Phoenix. 46:13 And the rate is I think 140 bucks or something like that still for 117° that doesn't jive with. Me. No, I'm sorry, No, I'm playing Greyhawk tomorrow. North Scottsdale course, you know Premier. 46:30 Talent. Premier course in Arizona for I think $95 and it you know, it's early morning tea time because you know, obviously the morning tea times are going to be more expensive, but little little life hack get on golf now book that tea time that they've got. 46:50 What is it? It's, I can't remember what the rates they call, but it's like the best deal of the day. Hot deals The hot deal on golf. Now book that tee time that nobody wants at 2:00 in the afternoon. Show up three hours early, check in and they'll they're, they have no problem sending you out. 47:11 Yo, that's really smart dude. That's. A really smart. Book right 'cause you're you're going out in those 140 price range tee time, right? But you just paid for the 40 dollar 3:00 tee time. So yeah, it's definitely worth it. 47:27 I did that two weeks ago. I played Padre, though I didn't play NBL today. But that's smart. I thought you were gonna say your pro tip was the free $20 tip. Thing I was like, not that I have a smart ass, but not that big a smart ass, yeah. 47:44 That's a great idea. I love that. Yeah, I mean, I, I, I think about that's, that's funny, 'cause like the last time we played insanely hot weather, we played Rams Hill in Borrego, Sean, and you showed up two or three hours early and the guy was like, brother, you can go out whenever you want, like. 48:01 Exactly it works. My one more caught I have here no turn stand so you just keep going after nine well. They they do have the little shack at the pro shop, but yeah, you're definitely detouring to get back to the pro shop to get a snack at at the turn, if you will. 48:25 Yeah, 'cause that there's that little. No, no, no. I think Rez, I think you're thinking of Padre. Padre goes by that. Ambiente Does Ambiente just goes out and back? There. Is a little, there is a little shack out there that has bathrooms, but like Sean, correct me if I'm wrong, I know it wasn't open the day that we were out there, but do they not man it? 48:46 At all. I don't even think it's a shack. It's just bathrooms. It's there's nothing out. There, the cart. The cart. OK, that's probably that. Like almost drivable par 4. That's the one I hate, the the one with the bunker placement. But there's. Just bathrooms, Yeah, there's nothing. 49:01 OK, OK, yeah, that's, yeah, that's that's a tough break because you know, if you're like I said, if you're having a bad front 9 UA can't leave or you'd be, you know, you know, from the track to leave. I know from experience. 49:17 And then plus the you, you can't even like try and save it with a glizzy or anything. There's no you got to hope you packed enough uncrustables for the group. Uncrustables sponsor us. Please God, Snickers, please. I would. I would. I would forego any other free stuff from any other brands for an uncrustable sponsorship. 49:38 My freezer is full of uncrustables, but not because I have a Costco card like you do. It's because at my profession I'm a firefighter, so we go to hospitals quite a bit and they have what's called the EMS room. The EMS room at all these hospitals is full of uncrustables. 49:56 So I load my pockets up, bring those home, and they go straight in the golf bag whenever I have a round planned. The the only other man. Say again. Are you Phoenix Fire Department? Yeah. Oh, cool. I like that. So. Yeah, the the only other, the only other man I've seen consume as many crustable uncrustables as myself on a golf course is rest. 50:17 Where? He's got like he, he's always got two or three like I do. Yeah, I think I ate like 3 on the front nine that day. At 7 canyons, yeah, I think it every time I look. It felt like every time I looked at you, you had another brand new uncrossable. 50:33 Right, I I definitely was like trying to ease my my high. I had that day. I ate some mushrooms before that round and I was I was like, man, I'm these are really kicking in hard. So I was like, I'll just eat some uncrustables. Maybe that'll help absorb them. 50:50 Just peanut. Butter and Jelly through the. Whole. Yeah, that. Shit'll fix anything man. Yeah. But no, I'm over the glizzy. I I swear to God anytime I eat a hot dog at the turn I go and score a double like they they do not help my game at all. 51:06 It's possible all day. I think I think the real problem, and we won't go full diatribe here, a hot dog. There's just too much going on to try and eat it while you're playing. I had the post the other day that got destroyed by the pace of play crowd about just I don't need a 10 minute break, like I'm not tired after the front 9. 51:29 I just want to sit down and enjoy whatever food I ordered at the turn in peace. Nobody understood the idea that, oh, if you just let the group behind you pass in front of you, then you just slide in behind him. And then the problem is that the that you now have three groups jammed into two groups tee times. 51:48 And you're banking on that group in front of you now playing faster to get up into your slot, which will not always happen. So now you have and then now I have the group behind me now just right on my ass and I'm on the group in front of them's ass. 52:04 It's like, dude, the what what people fail to understand was that if I just stop, if I'm allowed to have a 10 minute break or there is a sign up sheet, if I take my break or more other people take their breaks. You, if you want to be the guy who slides through, you still get to slide through. Like you still get to just cruise because people have taken those breaks. 52:22 Those tee times are open for you to just cruise. People fail to understand that. But hot dogs, just too much to eat. You're trying to dress it, eat it. Can you set it down? Do you just eat it in two bites? No, Yeah, you end up doing it. Yeah, you won't. Be down. It just doesn't. It doesn't. Have you seen I think a hot dog ever makes it past whole 10? 52:40 For me it's. Always. Yeah. Oh no, It's like before we tee off on 10 as you're gone. Yeah. Have you guys seen the way that golf is played like in China, how like you finish your nine and then you get like an hour break? Afterwards. 52:57 Yeah, and. Japan and. Korea, they do that. I don't know if you would like that, TJ, is, is that too much time or like you're guaranteed an hour to enjoy yourself and then get back out there? First and foremost, one, I am not here to disrespect anyone's culture. Again, you know, I'm, I'm marrying into a Japanese family at the end of the month. 53:18 So first and foremost, not not here to disrespect anyone's culture, but I think and it you know, it's tough because I I I definitely hear the the party of man. If I'm really in the groove and I'm feeling it taking an hour break, like do I do I go back out and warm up again? 53:39 Am I stiff? Like, especially if you're starting to get towards 40 and getting re warmed up again is an actual process to not pull something or, you know, hurt your back. Like, I understand that, but I mean, it golf is about so much more than just the golf, right? 53:57 It's yeah, it's it's about being out there with your boys. It's about enjoying nature. If you get that time, plus also if you get that hour booked in to hang out and have lunch with the boys, that's another like hour that you could be like, hey, gotta have lunch at the course. Like it's gonna take five hours. 54:14 We're gonna, we have to. It's it's customary to stop and eat. Normalize it. It's a whole thing. It's a full day in, in Japan. So I, I, I mean, I love that I, I tend to as a person who doesn't have any kids yet I tend to make golf days, full days anyway with arriving early. 54:33 Staying. After having a beer. Speaking of staying after and having a beer, I'll go. We'll jump back into the cons here. Terrible post round vibes here. Almost almost nowhere to sit and hang out no great real view of anything. 54:51 That turn stand is kind of just wedged in there underneath the pro shop and there's a few tables outside of it, but it doesn't like really overlook any of the holes like it's. It's a snack shack in a corridor where you drive past to drop off your bag or finish around. 55:11 It's really weird. It's not a. What about the restaurant? Have you ever sat at the restaurant? TJ hasn't, yeah. They have a little deck up there where you can like sit outside and look at I believe it's hole 18 for Padre. 55:28 And is there, is it hole 18 for Ambiente too or no? No, it's just Padre. No, just Padre. Yeah, it looks out over Padre right there with the water and whatnot. Yeah. The problem with that one though is that I have played this course a lot and there's a probably a one in four chance there's a wedding. 55:46 Oh yeah. There's a lot of weddings at this course and it's booked off so like there's nowhere to go. But I have sat. I have sat where you're. Talking about yeah, the one time that I sat out on that deck and had lunch and some beers was when I played with my uncle. 56:01 So maybe he was able to pull some strings. I don't know. Yeah, but yeah, it's not your most friendly type of environment to hang out with the boys and just drink some beers, you know? Yeah. It's not really advertised. 56:18 Yeah, just in general, I think that I have that for this course is the no turn stand in the post round scene. It's just like the for a resort course that you expect amenities with a resort course. This this one feels more about the course than it does the amenities of any resort in Scottsdale. 56:37 And it's not even attached to the resort, like to be honest, the hotel. Oh yeah, it's so far away. So far, yeah. Yeah, it's, it's like speaking your flag somewhere across town and being like, that's our resort. Course, yeah. If you're driving down Lincoln to Mockingbird, you go past the Marriott and then you keep driving like a mile and take that left and you're like, OK, the resort was way back that way. 56:58 But at the golf courses, yeah. Yeah. So I was definitely like, the first time I ever played, I was cruising down Lincoln, went by the Marriott at whatever light that is. I was like, is it here? And then my GPS kept having me go down to Mockingbird. And yeah, I definitely was kind of confused by that for sure. 57:16 Yeah, that resort opened in the 30s, by the way. It's a really old resort. That's cool. This course came 40 years after basically, and it was. Oh, it definitely was. An afterthought. Yeah, it was an acquisition. Have you guys done fair play on the Biltmore? 57:32 We just did the Adobe course with Alex from Babes Golf. Yeah. OK, that's right. You were out here and you played with babes golf, right, TJ? Yeah, yeah, my, the Sean was not. Yeah, I played both courses, but he's played it, yeah. 57:49 But let's be honest, it's it's now a states it's not Adobe Links. They'll be. They'll be in my heart forever. Yeah, yeah, Lynx is where it's at. That course is way more fun for sure than. The yeah for sure. I almost played Lynx last weekend but I read that the greens got tore up recently. 58:07 Like. Really. Not yeah, it's not in great shape, right? Now we ran. At least from the, we ran a call because my fire station is over in that area, that Biltmore area. And it was like those townhomes on that par three. I want to say it's hole 3 cause hole one is par 4. 58:26 Hole 2 is a par five. Yeah, it's hole 3 right next to these townhomes. And I went over there and I was kind of looking at it and sprinklers were going. I wasn't on the green, but I could see it looked like it was in pretty good shape. But yeah, that is Bill Moore's infamous for neglecting links and taking care of estates way better than they do. 58:49 Or they should so. You ever want to go play links? I'll go play links. I'm dude I have a fan of. I love links. That is what it's, it's super close to me too. Links Lookout Mountain. I mean I'll be honest, if I have the choice to play Ambiente or Padre, I choose Padre all day. 59:10 That's a hot. Take yeah, that that's one of well, since we're on cons, I'm too explain that Padre. I think Padre. OK, let me start with Ambiente cons. To me Ambiente is very repetitive. 59:29 Like we were talking about a lot of the par threes. A lot of the par threes to me all seem the same. A lot of the par fives all seen the same. It's like very, you know, there is elevation change, but it's more so on the fairways with just kind of like rolling hills. 59:44 You have this wash on the right hand side constantly where to me and Beyoncé just gets repetitive. It feels like I'm I'm. And then on the other side, Padre, I feel like you kind of get a a more of a resort style golf course with a little taste of that that Ambiente brings. 1:00:06 So I just feel like there's a little bit more, you know, different types of golf on Padre than there is in Beyoncé. Yeah. Have you had a chance to play Gainey Ranch if you're. No, I have not played Gainey Ranch, no. It, it very much reminds you of Gainey, but a public version of Gainey where it's like that, yeah, you're like it's corridors between homes with trees and a lot of overhangs. 1:00:27 But the but the holes are unique like you said on Padre and there's a lot of there's both dog like rights and. Left in Padre. Whereas Ambiente is more straight narrow like for the most part. Absolutely. So is Gainey private? Gainey's private. Yeah, we. 1:00:43 I've been lucky enough to go play in the summer when Jesse gets a invitation plus one. So he goes there every once in a while. Yeah, it's fun. But I, I, I, I know what you're saying about Padre because of the price. 1:01:00 I actually play Padre more than I play on Beyoncé. Yeah, which is crazy. How can you, you know, golf courses across Arizona, how are you going to price one course more? Like they're both your courses? How are you going to price one more expensive than the other? 1:01:16 I don't understand that at all. Like, are you putting more water on on Beyoncé? So you need to get more bang for your buck over there. You need to, you know, collect from that course. So yeah, I mean, regardless of price, I'm I'm playing and that's a plus. 1:01:32 But Padre in my opinion is is more fun than than Ambiente. It's like a $40 difference sometimes between the courses too. That's that's insane. Yeah yeah. Sticking on cons yeah, Playing in peak season and ambiente. 1:01:50 The only reason why I know is because my uncle will be working and I'll go to golf now. I'll look at the T sheet and see what times are available that I can squeeze in, right? And I see these prices and it's no cheaper than $250. It's like 200 to like 250 to like 350. 1:02:11 Twitch is just absolutely absurd in my opinion. Yeah, and there's a lot of bachelor parties out at this course during peaks. Absolutely. So that was another thing that like, I know we, I had my limited experience when you and I played that one day, but also I'll usually poke around into some other people's reviews on golf now and and Google and whatnot to to. 1:02:33 Kind of look to see. If my set to see if my experience was a unique experience or if it is the common experience amongst everybody. And right there along with bachelor parties on golf courses comes slow pace of play. And we were definitely like jammed up behind. 1:02:50 I think we got jammed up behind like a twosome that was jammed up behind a foursome when you and I played Sean that day. And it was brutal. Like it was at like, we almost like, I think we like purposely stopped to like when we went to the bathroom at 9 and like purposely like took our time 'cause we were like, we're just right on these guys heels every single time. 1:03:10 And that seemed to be the sentiment when I looked online was that a lot of people are like, hey, there's a real pace of play problem out here, which tends to happen a lot at resort courses. You do get a lot of people who are out of towners who are just out there having a good time playing a golf round and don't care how long the round takes. 1:03:31 But I understand like, you know, when you're local and you're having to fork out that cash during peak season, you also don't want to spend, you know, all day out there. Yeah, yeah, with a real quick note, I once played as a single and on Beyoncé. 1:03:50 Found a hot deal actually, and didn't go 3 hours early, unfortunately. That's such a smart move. I'm going to remember that. But I got stuck behind a bunch of guys because they sent me out as a single. They were like, Oh yeah, they're like this gap, so go ahead and play. Well, I knew I was going to run up on a, on a group, right? 1:04:07 And I did by like whole 3. I just waited and played two balls. So I was like, you know, I'm having fun. I'm not in a rush, but at some point I, I was driving me nuts. And so like on hole 11 or 12, whatever that first part 4 is after that Part 3. So I think it's 12. I was like, I'm gonna be that guy. 1:04:23 Do you guys mind if I play it through real quick? And they're like, no, of course, go ahead. And, you know, talk about pressure on a tee shot. Is there any more pressure than when you asked to play through? Not at all. They're all standing around. I'll hit that shot and I I'll know it's shit and I'll just keep going. 1:04:41 I'll skip the hole. Sometimes I'll just completely skip the hole. And yeah, my dignity for the next one, yeah. Yeah, it's like the heartbeat, you know, effect on video game. And I, I just remember I striped it like it was one of my best drives. 1:04:57 I had not been playing great actually that day and that was probably one of my best drives. And of course, I had to play it off like I've been hitting that all day. Yeah. Thanks. You know, they're all Yep. Who was dude on the golf course right there? Baddest dude on the golf course right there. A quick a quick T pick up on a playthrough just feels so great. 1:05:17 You don't even have to look to see where the ball goes because you know, you know, you can just walk right back to the cart and just drive out right to it. Just a quick look at them, like, thanks guys, you know? Oh yeah. Do you know who has one of the best tee pickups? By the way? I hate that I'm admitting this as Mike Dresser. So. Does he? 1:05:33 If he hits one, stripes it, he'll pick the tee up before it even lands. He'll turn back and go tell me if it's any good and he'll walk to the cart. Oh my God. Wow. He does it in a match. He's like trying to get in your head. Yeah. Whatever, Mike. 1:05:50 Oh good. All right, with that, let's get into the bus play test. But before we do, let's hear again from our sponsor for today, Clinch Golf. TJI want to talk to you about our sponsor for today's episode, Clinch Golf. I've been using their glove for about 6 months now in the Arizona heat. 1:06:07 It's still holding up. I put it in the bag, I pull it out and it looks just like it did when I threw it in. Unlike other gloves, which are all crinkled, it has some of the best grip on the clubs that I've ever felt and I'm honestly very impressed. I know it has something to do with how they make the glove. 1:06:23 Maybe you could talk a little bit more about the one that you have. Yeah, I mean, I know that people think like a non leather golf glove. Hard pass. But like, let's think about this. What used to always be leather in the game of golf, the grips. What is no one using anymore? Leather golf grips? 1:06:38 They've been replaced with more synthetic or rubber materials that enhance the grip, that feel a lot better. Why would you not think about doing the exact same thing with your gloves? And like these gloves, they're reinforcing the palm so they're not going to tear in that spot where almost every golf glove has ever torn across the entirety of time. 1:06:57 And they may have accidentally created the best, worst business model ever where we're not looking to replace these gloves for over six months. So if you're someone who wants to see the difference and upgrade your golf game, you're going to want to visit clinchgolf.com and use promo code FAIR WAGERS to get 10% off today. 1:07:13 All right, let's get into the must play test. TJ and I have devised an objective, a test here of 10 questions to determine if a course is a must play. The course must score a six out of 10 to be up for debate or get a 7 out of 10 or higher to automatically earn our coveted must play status. So question one, the Augusta test. 1:07:30 Is this course easy to get a tee time on? Does it have a straightforward booking process and are there times available the week of your intended play? TJ, you want to kick us off or actually res you? Probably player you guys are the experts here. I'm, you know, going to be a little, you know, my opinion is going to be a little different because I'm, I'm out there waiting for open spaces for my uncle to Get Me Out for free, you know, but I'm going to say no because this place for some reason is as expensive as it is for the most part. 1:08:10 Like tee times are pretty booked up most of the most of the first half a day, even into the late afternoons when the weather's good here. So no, that's a name for me. I I'm going to disagree only because I am on golf now daydreaming every once in a while. 1:08:31 And I will say weekends are tough to get on this course. Weekdays, if you work from home or you can sneak out, this course is usually available to go play the same day. I can find the tea time at Padre Ambiente. I just have to pony up the money, which I don't want to do. 1:08:48 Which comes to the next question, right? But five out of the seven days, I can almost always find a tea time same day at at Ambiente. It's just because I think people don't want to pay that rate. Right on a. Tuesday on a weekend they're willing to pay it, but on a Wednesday or Tuesday they're not so. 1:09:08 That's fair. That's fair. I would say yeah. I you can no I. I I, I I think I might have jumped the gun on that a little bit. I stand corrected. Yeah. I mean, week weekday warrior, yeah. You're going to be able to get out. Weekend warriors. 1:09:23 No. So yeah. It is tough on the weekends, yeah. As the as the tie break here, I was only really considering either of your opinions in this and Rez LED off with I'm not a good I don't have a good frame of reference here because of how he usually gets out on the course. 1:09:46 And then Sean referenced almost exactly what you want to hear, like for the definition of this question, right? Tough to book out on the weekends and easy to get out on the weekdays. But we know that most people are playing out on the weekends. So and then Rez came around. 1:10:02 So we're going to fail that. So it's a pass or? Are you failing? You just failed it. No, it's. You know why you failed it after that wait. Hold on, hold on, hold on. Sorry, on Augusta test here is it. 1:10:18 Easy. OK. But if we're going majority of golfers, most golfers are weekend golfers? Yeah, this is enough. It's tough because yeah, like what do you, what do we, what do we always try and balance it on? Well, like I. 1:10:36 Think here's the other, here's the other thing. You can also book this course out way in advance, like I looked last night. You can book it out into like mid-october right now, which is like crazy to think that like they're like, Oh yeah, like most courses I know. 1:10:52 I mean, obviously California's different. California's got like 30 day windows and it feels like Arizona has like 60 and 90. Yeah. What'd you say, Sean? You said you passed it. I'm I'm passing it for sure. Yeah, I think we can. 1:11:07 I think we can pass it also knowing that it's going to definitely fail the next. Question you for example two guys. Yeah. Two players want to get, two players want to get on tomorrow. You have 20 tee times to choose from ranging from 6:30 in the morning till 3:00 PM. 1:11:28 Mind you folks, it's Wednesday today, so tomorrow's Thursday. And what's the high? What's the high tomorrow? A. 117° let's go. I mean, let's go, let's go Saturday. 1:11:44 Yeah, what about Saturday morning? Saturday has time has 20 times between 9:00 and noon for. Getting out at 9:00 is not a good time to get out right now, I mean. No, it's summer. It's summer, it's going to be the sun's up by 5:00 AM, so it's hot by 6 AMI. 1:12:02 Think I I think when we're when we're constantly in search of a course that is a must play a really good course, a really good course can pass both the Augusta and the bang for your buck test. But generally, when most of the courses fall into where we want them to kind of fall, if you pass one, you fail the other and it's vice versa, right? 1:12:25 So I think if we jump a little bit ahead here, Sean, question 2, the bang for your buck test, what's the definition? Is this golf course worth the rate you pay? Do you feel like it's a good value during peak season? It's gonna be a fail. 1:12:41 From us. It's a fail for me on that. We can retroactively pass the Augusta test knowing that we have now failed the bang for your buck, yeah. Sounds good, I can sleep well at night. Yeah, it all worked out. It all worked. Out. OK, so we are one for two. 1:12:57 Let's skip ahead. We are one for two. Question 3. The Iverson test does of course have good practice facilities. Would you spend time warming up here or just head for the bar before the round? You talk about practice, Yeah. Not. A game. Not a guess. But I'm going to say right now the only like I don't need a driving range to warm up. 1:13:19 All I want to do when I warm up now is chip and putt. That's it. Like I don't like taking big hacks on the range. I feel like it does nothing for my game to where I just I, you know, get the hands warmed up, get the mitts softened up a little bit and then roll some putts, get a feel for how the greens are rolling and then just just raw dog it on toll one do. 1:13:46 You know what I think that changes though that scenario is if we lived in a cold place, like, you know what I'm saying? Like you don't want to go out stiff and cold. And. Go swing a club. But here in Arizona, you're loose already. You're just. Yeah, I'm the same as you, Rez. 1:14:03 Like recently I haven't been warming up at all. I just go putt or chip and then I go and some of my best like opening holes will be because of that versus the winter like I definitely need to probably swing a few. And, and like, don't get me wrong, like I beat the hell out of my body the past 37 years. 1:14:22 So every morning I wake up and I hit my foam roller. So I, I, I get the body moving, you know, it's not like I'm just rolling out of bed and then showing up. Yeah, I, I, I definitely believe in warming up the body a little bit. But yeah, taking a bunch of hacks on the range is does game no good. 1:14:41 That's the D is warm up method right there TJ dude. I yearn for a day where I feel confident enough in my golf swing to step up on a first D and swing freely. I just probably have not hit enough golf balls in my life yet. 1:14:58 So where I have that confidence, I think I think also like chances are, if I'm playing golf that week, I have also not gone to the range that week. Like my allotted like golf time for that week is the round. And I also talked about how I like to make golf full experience, right? So I'm going to take my time. 1:15:15 I'm going to get there early. I'm probably going to have a bite to eat. I'll make sure I use the restroom, you know, get everything situated, get cart laid out, sometimes a cart Cam, sometimes recording equipment, whatnot. So hitting balls is included in that. 1:15:31 So I, I mean, I'm just, I'm a. So this place has an opportunity for you to do all of that is what we're saying this is. 100% yeah, it was a pass in the longest way possible. It's definitely. A pass? Yeah, sounds like a weekend warrior. That's what I'm talking about that. 1:15:46 Yeah. Talk about that tea time. Yeah, man, soak it in, right? Yeah, 6-7 hours. It's 7 hours for a round of golf, right? That's what I what I tell everyone. Right. All right. We're 2 for three. Here, Yeah. Yeah, 2 for three. 1:16:03 OK, question for the Jonesy test, could you see yourself spending $100 on merch in their pro shop? Do they have a logo or peril worth wearing? My man thrifts for this hat. I mean, that's a. Strong. But I guess again, I'm I'm going to be biased on my situation. 1:16:18 I rarely buy new hats. Yeah, because I know I can go find a vintage one that's way cooler. Yeah, but that'll be that. Put that aside. Their logo is one of the coolest logos in the Arizona golf scene. 1:16:33 So yeah, I give them a pass for sure. And their their pro shop has a lot of good options. Like, I know TJ and I were looking around when we were in there together, but in the past I have bought ball markers from here. I bought a towel from here and this is like one of the few places I have bought those things from. 1:16:51 I don't think you bought a ball marker from here, did you DJ? I did. I did. OK. If we play a course, and I'm fairly certain we're gonna do must play on it, I buy a ball marker from it. I've got. A Buy a ball marker. I've got a few missing that I did not know, but that before we started doing the podcast that I need to go back and and recollect upon. 1:17:09 Yeah. But but yeah, I picked one up then so. And yeah, this one's a pass. This one's a pass for me. How about you A? Hundred 100% the the I like, I like I gorged over the logo earlier. You know, props to these guys for sticking it out and not bastardizing a camel into, you know, some rough outline of the mountain and then turning that into camelback. 1:17:35 They suck with a nice animated cartoon camel from the 70s and the original font and it is paid dividends that now it is a sick logo that looks good in current times and is still vintage at the same time. Yeah. 1:17:50 Bingo. There you go. All right, strong start here. 3 for four. Question 5, The Buzzworthy test. Are there multiple holes worth talking about? Does this course have more than one hole that a group would immediately want to go play again? We'd like to go. 1:18:07 I can. I can lead in my brain. 10 obviously sticks out as what is almost a drivable par 4, depending upon what tease you're playing from that day and, and what you hit the big stick. 1:18:22 Like you know that that hole is one of those ones where you hit driver and you end up in the bunker and you go, Ah, man, I, I really wish I would have played A5 wood there that day. Or, or laid up with an iron or you do hit driver really well and you're like, hell yeah, dude. 1:18:40 I would love to go back and play that driver and, or play that hole again and hit driver maybe even further, maybe even drive degree really step on right. But I, I, I do somewhat man, it's tough 'cause like, like Rez said, the some of those par threes feel really close together. 1:18:59 But then there's some really cool holes with like really nice backdrops, but I don't think that that makes the hole all that much better. It really. Doesn't. There's no, there's really, that's what I was going to say is there's really no like signature hole for this course, let alone two or three that you want to talk about. 1:19:20 Yeah. Well, it sounds like you're getting towards no. I I think I got to fail it. Yeah. Yeah, I think I got to fail it. Sean, what about you? Yeah, go ahead, Sean. I'm a fail and I all the same reasons. I mean, it's just as a collection. 1:19:36 It's a fun challenge. Like you said, it's a tough course, but if I was going to go say, OK, pick the best 1st hole in Scottsdale, no, go pick the best 2nd hole in Scottsdale and it can come from any course. I don't think any of the eighteen holes would come from this course. I just, I don't see it. 1:19:52 Yeah, that that's, I don't know, the only hole that stands out to me on Ambiente is hole one. Yeah. That's the only one that I can like, really like, you know? Yeah. Think about how I can play this hole, you know? 1:20:09 Yeah. Can you? Can you cut the corner? Do you like right? Is it the is it the seven wood? Is it the five wood? You know, is it an iron off the tee shot to where I feel like if I built a course out of all the Scottsdale courses and I had to use one hole from Ambiente, it would be hole one. 1:20:32 Yeah, OK, fair against my argument, but this definition is more than one hole that a group would want to go play again or more than one buzz worthy hole and. We're saying, yeah, so we're gonna fail this one for sure. How about we do another pod in the future, TJ with Rez, where we construct the ultimate Scottsdale golf course and we pick a hole from each? 1:20:53 That that might be the I I haven't played enough, but I will mediate we. Can do that, yeah. And the only time he comes to Arizona is when it's peak season and the rates are out of this world. I mean, he used he, he put in his time, he used to live. 1:21:09 Here, I did. I did. I did my dues. It's just it did your time. It did my time. I, you know, why would I? Why would I? Who wants to leave San Diego? Right, you're that San Diego thing. But I don't blame you. I'm just jealous. I am too all of a sudden. 1:21:25 Especially right now. Right now is right now is very much sad boy season in Arizona for sure. Yes. Granted, you know, it hasn't been that bad this summer until like August rolled around. July was actually not bad this. 1:21:40 Year July was amazing. Yeah, all relative people would hear what we said the temps were and still say Oh my. God, but. For us, July was way better than 2024 for. Sure. OK, but we're 3 for five here. So question 6, the glizzy test. 1:21:57 Does this course have good food at the turn? Are you eating here or packing your own uncrustables? Uncrustables. You, you have to. You don't even have a, there's no, you don't even have a choice. You have to pack your own uncrustables. I mean, I think, I think the cart girl did have some sandwiches in the cart. 1:22:14 You know, she had a Turkey sandwich and probably like a BLT or whatever, like stuff that's it's refrigerated pretty well. But I think as anyone can attest, a a sandwich out of a out of the cart from the cart grill is usually not the best sandwich you've ever had in your life. You haven't really been yearning for it so. 1:22:31 Or the hot dogs. I remember I got a hot dog from the cart girl Beyoncé. Yeah, she had some little thing and it was, you know, as you can probably predict, disgusting soggy bread. The all had a had like the pruney effect like your fingers get in in the pool. 1:22:53 Yeah, yeah, it was not a enticing looking hot dog baby. If if you sell hot dogs on a cart, are you still a cart girl? Or are, you know, a hot dog vendor that just happens to sell other stuff? Yeah, mobile hot dog cart. Yeah. But it's a fail, it sounds like from all of us on this 100%. 1:23:12 OK, so adversity here, 3 for six. It's got to pass three of the next 4 questions here to be up for debate. Question 7, the Marshall test. Does this course have a decent pace of play? Can you rely on a relatively quick round here if you have somewhere to be? After we touched on this earlier about the bachelor parties and slower play as a con, we did say that if I'm playing. 1:23:35 I I would say peak season, no, but that's a lot of the case for all of these courses in Arizona. Aaron Turner has a destination golf to where people, you know, make trips out here for golf. So the golf courses are going to jump on that and put tee times every seven to 10 minutes. 1:23:58 You know, like some of these courses are absurd with their time frame that they're booking these tee times. So yeah, pace of play during that type of during that season is dog shit trash. As I like to refer to things, let's. 1:24:15 See, let's see what their tee times are spaced out at. They have 10 minute intervals on their tee times. Here SO. Here's here's the other thing, right? We, we could talk about peak season and that's expected, right? But then we talk about this Saturday where the tee times are, the tee sheets clearly full up until 9:00 AM. 1:24:33 So when everybody wants to play, when you have this wash that runs through most of the course, and we can say that, we can confidently say that most golfers move the ball left to right or just right. What's going to end up happening is that when the course is full, you're going to get people down in the wash trying to find their ball. 1:24:56 So inherently, the more people that you have looking for balls, we can all say we know what we feel like 3 minutes looks like. Ask our significant others if they actually know what 3 minutes feels like and they're not and we're taking way longer to to look for three minutes. 1:25:13 So it actually it actually works in the other direction in this instance I guess. Yeah. But yeah. Yeah, but we would. Like that's where things start to actually jam up. Is somebody going down looking for a ball, not knowing where it's at, then playing a drop from down there, maybe hitting another one back into the wash or or hitting one and then it's kind of blind because you're down in the wash. 1:25:36 I think that, I think that, I think it's just, I think it's always a problem just due to the nature of the kind of layout of the course and that people aren't going to inherently want to go look for the ball down there because you can go down there. So that just naturally will create a backup. So it's a fail for. OK, It it's interesting in terms of other courses that I think of in this, call it Central Valley area, you know, like Papa goat, right? 1:26:03 We'll cover that eventually on this pod, but that's one of the worst cases of play of any course where you get guys bunched up at certain holes no matter what. And then there's courses that are like talking stick not too far away. That gets a lot of bachelor parties, a lot of groups and it's somewhat slow, but it's not because of the layout, it's just because of the clientele, the people who go this course feels like it has a bit of both where there are some holes that naturally are going to get bunched up on like that par 3. 1:26:36 When you make the turn to come back the other way, that's one of the holes that always there's like I, I've never played that. When it's our turn to play, we've always been backed up on that. And then on top of that you get people who are coming from Old Town and stuff like that. So I think it's a fail as well, unfortunately. Yeah, I think that's three fails. 1:26:54 Not to think that a course without a turn stand fails this test. I know also. Crazy to crazy to say we failed a Marshall test with a guest who has a Marshall relationship. Hey, I know I. Know my uncle. And I know his buddies that are also Marshalls out there and they're not taking their job that seriously. 1:27:14 I'll just put. It No, no, no, no. OK, so we're 3 for seven here. Question 8. The high handicapper test the Would a mid to high handicapper enjoy this course in typical conditions? Is it fair to all handicaps and are the greens or pin positions fair? 1:27:30 No, I'm going to say no because when most people first start golfing or their handicap is higher, they struggle with most golfers are right-handed. Most golfers hit that, that slice and you're just went to go say you're in the wash and now you're looking for your ball. 1:27:48 It's going to be tough. It's going to slow down pace. It's yeah, no, it, it's, it's not for high handicappers in my opinion. I I would say also on top of that, I agree with you, an indictment on this course would be I would take the high handicapper to Padre first. I would be, yeah, I'd be like, go play Padre, get your feet under you and feel more confident, and then let's go play on Beyoncé the next day if we're staying somewhere around there, you know? 1:28:12 Yeah. Yeah, I mean, like I we talked about when we talked about first impressions, I shot a 56 on the front. We could talk about the 40, but that was the kind of, in my case, the stars aligning right. 1:28:29 Everything went right for once in my book to shoot a 40 on the back nine. But the the front 9 was yeah. I mean, I was Sean, you were in the cart with me that day. I was miserable. Like it was like even if I tried to take a 5 iron off the tee, I was still finding myself like in weird problems. 1:28:48 And it's just one of those ones that like the, the wash is weird 'cause it gives you that weird hope that you might go down there and find the ball. And then you got there and you don't find the ball and then you're pissed 'cause you didn't find it. And then you've got to drop 3 and then try and like move to a next shot mentality within like 30 seconds. 1:29:07 And that's really hard to do as well 'cause you're still pissed off about the ramifications from the old shot. So yeah, I had this one down as like, it was kind of a toss up. But now that I've like, fully thought about it, I'm like, yeah, it just compounds too much. It it ends up being a fail. 1:29:23 You're going to get boned out there for most amateur offers, OK? 3 for eight it's officially not a must play, but let's see. Let's see if he can get up to five at least. Question 9 The vibes test. Is this course worth staying at post round? 1:29:39 Do they have a good restaurant or patio C? I think we we covered this one a little earlier in the mod. Oh yeah, no. Should we just fail? Should we just speed this up and just all go thumbs down right away? Yeah, we could speed it up. 1:29:55 I mean, let's go question 10 here, the dime a dozen. Is it unique to the area or could you get this golf experience somewhere else on your trip or visit? I will pass it on this one. I. Will say, yeah, yeah, go ahead. We're all passing. I mean, just your history that you gave us about it being ambiente and environmentally, you know, sustainable to the area or whatever. 1:30:18 I'm with that. I dig that and it's and it's and it's on par. Yeah, no pun intended. And it's got Mummy Mountain and Camelback right behind it. And it's got the view and it's central and. It's a beautiful course. It's a beautiful course. Yeah. 1:30:33 Even though we're scoring this a four out of 10, which I did not expect going into this, I would still play this over Silverado, Continental, Coronado, McCormick, all the other courses we talked about. I would still say, yeah, go play Ambiente. 1:30:49 You don't. Like McCormick. I do like McCormick, but like, I think this is, you know, objectively a better course. Than McCormick, Yeah, yeah, I would say that, yeah. Yeah, the we talked about the conditions, conditions wise, like you're gonna get, you're gonna get the best conditions out of all those courses in that Scottsdale area. 1:31:11 Yeah, at at Camelback. Yeah. So are we saying 4 out of 10? It's it's it's a pass on the on the dime a dozen. It's the best, Yeah. It's. A unique experience in the area, but. I think this is the lowest score on the pod so far. 1:31:30 I I hate to say it, but I kind of saw this coming, yeah. When you look at the rubric I. Mean I I've it, it has its pros. It has four pros out of 10 or passive. But in in my opinion, it's it's it's not my favorite Scottsdale course. 1:31:49 I'll just put it. If we were going to have you come back on the pod, which I very much want to do, what course do you think would score really high on this test on on all 10? Like, what's a course you would love to kind of, you know, champion on the pod? You know, I would, I would, I'd be down to do some of my favorite courses here in the like in my, in my hood, right? 1:32:14 That took me 20 minutes to get to, 15 minutes to get to. I would do the the Point Lookout Mountain. Lookout. Lookout to Great Coors and then of course we talked about earlier the links at Biltmore at. Biltmore. 1:32:30 Yeah, I I think that would be a good one and would score pretty high on this. Cool. Yeah. I also want to do Raven and Legacy eventually on this pod too. OK, we'll have to cover them. But I have, I have counter opinions on both of those. 1:32:48 Yeah, I like 1 and I can't stand the other. Oh, really? Yeah, we'll keep that as oh. Tell a switch we'll keep it a. Secret. Yeah, exactly. I might keep it a secret. All right, well, Camelback, you're 4 out of 10. As always, we recommend people go play and form their own opinion, but hopefully this podcast was enlightening to kind of give you an expectation about what you'll face when you go. 1:33:10 But Rez, I want to ask about you. So anything you want to kind of promote before we go or anything coming up that you got any more modelling maybe perhaps? Hey, yeah, I appreciate it. I I technically work for Devereaux. I don't know. 1:33:25 I'm an ambassador for them. So that does include, you know, getting paid. So if you go and get on Devereaux and you use my code Senior 15, I get 10% of that sale. 1:33:43 So Oh yeah, by all means, go buy it up Senior 15. What a great code, yeah. Also, Devereaux more than just clothes too. Head covers, hats, towels, accessories. Great stuff. Yeah, all, all the accessories, you know, T-shirts, the clothing that they do are T-shirts, shorts and polos pretty much. 1:34:08 But then all the accessories, hats, head covers, tons of head covers. And then what I love about them is they continue to pump stuff out. They do all kinds of different lines, different themes. And yeah, they're just, they're just grinding over there. 1:34:24 Love those guys. Shout out to Bird and Will. Shout out to Chinos Cody and my guy Jordy. Those guys are great. Have you have you gotten the chance to work with Andrew Paulson yet? 1:34:41 You met Andrew? I don't think so. Who's he with? He he just came over from from Linksol. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. He was at the photo shoot. Yes. I met Andrew for the first time the other day last week. Yeah, we we played with him the first. 1:34:57 Was that the first time we played GOAT Sean? Yeah, him and AZ. We played with him and him and AZ before AZ came on and did goat with us and we met him and he was at Linksol at the time and then I saw. That he was. Moving to Arizona and going to Devereux and I was like, that's a, that's a good get for them. I was. Like, oh, I didn't know he moved out here. 1:35:13 Yeah, he moved, Yeah. So OK, yeah, they let me know they got a new designer, like a lead designer, and he came over from what was it called true links or something like that. Linksol he's. On Linksol. Linksol Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 1:35:29 So I met Andrew just last week. First time meeting him, good guy. Heck yeah. Love, love, love how interconnected it like weirdly feels in the Southern California, Arizona golf world that it's like. Yeah, you know, also Andrew. 1:35:46 Andrew's a great shit talker. Oh my gosh. Go play around with him. Yeah, go play. Get get out on the course with him. I didn't get a lot of his personality because it was, you know, just that first formal meeting, you know? Yeah, You know, seeing him in his with interacting with some of the other guys at Devereaux, yeah, you could definitely see that there was some some poking fun, you know, Shit, shit. 1:36:12 For sure it's fun. An all time shit talker for sure. Well, thank you so much. Thank you so much for joining. This is a lot of fun for everyone who's stuck around the entire episode. Thank you. If you don't already, please make sure to subscribe to Must Play wherever you get your podcasts. 1:36:30 Rate is five stars. It helps out a ton. You can also watch the video version of these over on YouTube by searching for fair wagers or must play. And we drop occasional matches and non podcast content over there as well. So TJ Rez, thank you guys so much. It was a pleasure having you both on. Thank you guys so much for having me out, I thoroughly enjoyed this. 1:36:49 Had a great time. All right, we'll see you next time.